Broken double at the catpaw

[Kurt Carlson]

Been feeling pretty bullet proof since I got my new outfit.  Had landed all the fish I've hooked up lately.  Fish were OK sized.  Yesterday I finally got into a big one, huge splash and drag screaming out, then nothing .  I reeled in my line to find the braid broken at where I guess the cat paw joined the braid and the twisted mono.  I am wondering if I did not do enough loops on the cat paw.  I usually used 4 loops, is that enough?  I use PowerPro 80lb braid.  I thought I had retired my "F" dance for at least a while 

[Brandon Khoo]

Kurt - are you saying that the bimimi loop broke or that the loop cut through the bimimi double?

[Kurt Carlson]

Hey Brandon,  All that was left was the 2 pieces of braid at the bottom of the bimini loop.  The twisted double mono was gone.  I am not sure if the braid loop broke or the mono cut through the braid.  I am a bit concerned my knot was buggered.  No one here really fishes for GTs so I have no one to compare notes/knots with.

[Jay Burgess]

This happened to me recently under very heavy drag with a big GT. I couldn't determine whether is was cut at the catspaw itself or part way up the bimini double but I could only assume the double came into contact with reef. Never had a twisted leader/bimini connection fail like that before and I regularly check the integrity of my line for nicks.

[Brandon Khoo]

Kurt - are the two broken ends of the bimimi double the same length?

[Stephen Polzin]

I don't think the mono would cut through braid.  If anything it should be the other way round.  Is it possible a toothy fish like barracuda/mackerel could have bit the join as it raced through the water?

[Luke Wyrsta]

Mostly likely... A: the braid slicing the mono or, B: you have not snugged the catspaw neatly - the braid has cut into itself

[Kurt Carlson]

The broken braid was the same length.

The line could have touched the reef.  The drag was pretty tight and the fish was heading for the inside of 8-10 foot surf really fast.

I try to ensure the catpaw is even, but it does not snug up with a pull.  I kind of do a push/pull thing to tighten it up.

How many times do you all loop?

[Brandon Khoo]

gees, a break right in the middle of the loop would indicate it broke in the middle of the catspaw for some reason.
I posted a thread a while back on attaching a twisted leader to a bimimi double

see www.gtpopping.com/forum/index.php?topic=506.0

[Travis Heaps]

That post of Brandons is what I was also going to say - when you snug up your cats paw make sure it is pulling on the sides of the mono loop and not the actual middle part of the loop.  However from what i've read that's more so it doesn't cut the mono?  Unless when the mono cut there was a shock loading effect or something on the braid that cause it to break/cut itself. 

I wouldn't be too disheartened Kurt - it may have been one of those things that if you actually knew what really happened you wouldn't believe it anyway  .  Set you bimini and twisted up like Brandon has shown and try again.

[Brandon Khoo]

As Travis wrote, in the very large majority of cases, it is the mono that gets cuts by the braid when you permit the catspaw to bunch at the end of the twisted leader loop. You've got me completely stumped!    

All you can do is rig up and try again! I hope it wasn't a Sea Frog you lost   

[Graham Scott]

Kurt,
You may not have done anything wrong. I use doubles to a range of leaders for a range of purposes, including a lot of jigging and reef fishing. If you get totally bricked and have to break off it's common that the middle of the bimini lets go. It's just the weakest link in the whole chain to the hook.  Where else would it break?
If the bimini doesn't break then I wonder what I did wrong.

Maybe too much drag plus water pressure? Remember the load at the knot near the fish is lot more than the load at the spool on your reel, and gets worse as the length between the 2 increases and the speed of the fish increases.

[Kurt Carlson]

Thank you all for your comments.  I have a feeling my knot was ok, I just got beat.  Having no one here to compare notes with makes me question how well I am doing this stuff.

With that, I am re-rigged and ready to try again.

[Travis Heaps]

You'll find no shortage of people to compare notes with here Kurt - the beauty of the internet.  Post a few close up photos of your set up or bits and pieces you have questions about and we'll help out best we can.

[Ben Rutkin]

I used to use an albright onto the twisted leader but found that the braid would cut through the mono (ie I would get back the full bimini loop) since changing to fluorocarbon leader, this didnt happen anywhere near as much.

I went to the Cairns quickie but after 50 casts this knot is suffering significant wear and tear after going through the guides behind a 100-150g popper.