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Topwater Caranx Ignobilis: Giant Trevally (GT) => Tackle & Techniques => Topic started by: dfish on April 03, 2007, 02:47:57 PM

Title: Bills Bugs
Post by: dfish on April 03, 2007, 02:47:57 PM: Have any of you guys used the bills bug poppers if so what do you think, also what do you recomend if anything as a cheaper alternative to the jobu's on popper ,stickbaits.

Cheers
Title: Re: bills bugs
Post by: Brandon Khoo on April 03, 2007, 08:38:57 PM: I haven't used them myself but they are a proven fish catcher. Their finish is not great (actually, it's bloody abysmal) but I don't think GTs are are too worried about that.

Unfortunately, not too many option in stickbaits that are at a reasonable price outside of the Gillies but plenty of choices among poppers like Halco Roostas, River2Sea Dumbbells, Gillies, Tropic Anglers etc. I'm now carrying some Dumbbells and Yo-Zuri Surface Bulls as sacrifical lambs to throw into deadly looking areas where you would hesitate to throw your fisherman lure into
Title: Re: bills bugs
Post by: Greg Burt on April 03, 2007, 09:23:53 PM: Been looking at the Yo-Zuri Bulls and Cruisers myself, they look alright to me having never seen the top notch ones, do they, Dumbells and Roosters need an upgrade of hardware for something serious. At $27 for the Yo-Zuris and under $20 for the rest will they do the job.
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Luke Wyrsta on April 03, 2007, 09:33:31 PM: Try some Owner SJ-41s - i can't remember how much they cost, but i do think they are cheaper.

They are a smaller gauge than the 51s and don't have the cutting point but they are still a great hook.
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Brandon Khoo on April 03, 2007, 10:34:26 PM: Luke - you're suggesting that Greg go with singles in place of the trebles for his poppers when he upgrades the hooks? I've been experimenting myself for some time with the singles (see specific thread on this) but still not 100% convinced. I'm pretty sure they hold better but I still think the hookup rate is lower.
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Luke Wyrsta on April 03, 2007, 10:41:55 PM: Quote from: Brandon on April 03, 2007, 10:34:26 PM
Luke - you're suggesting that Greg go with singles in place of the trebles for his poppers when he upgrades the hooks? I've been experimenting myself for some time with the singles (see specific thread on this) but still not 100% convinced. I'm pretty sure they hold better but I still think the hookup rate is lower.

I agree with you Brandon, just responding to one of the questions in the original thread which i think some of you guys may have missed ;)

I have been using a 50/50 lately on *some* poppers/sticks - should be able to do a lot of testing if i have my hands full as i predict in Kiribati ;D :o
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Brandon Khoo on April 04, 2007, 08:06:32 AM: You're experimenting with a 50/50 combination? I haven't thought of that but it makes some sense! Would you run the treble off the back of on the middle?
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Luke Wyrsta on April 04, 2007, 06:54:47 PM: Quote from: Brandon on April 04, 2007, 08:06:32 AM

You're experimenting with a 50/50 combination? I haven't thought of that but it makes some sense! Would you run the treble off the back of on the middle?

I've been trying a big single on the belly and treble on the rear. I don't have much evidence to prove one is better than the other at the moment. Due to the sizes (weights) of the big hooks i am using, i am sure to make note of any changes to dynamics, balance, action etc... if there is any at all as well. I tried a 12/0 single on the belly and 8/0 treble on the back not long ago on a big 300mm Plat Billy - very heavy :o
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Brandon Khoo on April 04, 2007, 08:14:41 PM: Luke - how did you find the big Billy in how it swam? I am struggling to use it where it doesn't break the surface.Should I use two big recorders? I do like the look of this lure as i think it is big enough to attract a 70kg GT ;D
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Luke Wyrsta on April 04, 2007, 11:09:27 PM: Quote from: Brandon on April 04, 2007, 08:14:41 PM
Luke - how did you find the big Billy in how it swam? I am struggling to use it where it doesn't break the surface.Should I use two big recorders? I do like the look of this lure as i think it is big enough to attract a 70kg GT ;D

I wasn't too worried with the fact that it was breaking the surface, although i do agree that subsurface with no surface breaking is also a good technique, i still find that making some noise along the way is good too. Two big recorders in 7/0 or 8/0 might be able to keep it fully subsurface. I also tried out a Billy Mega Pop - don't go there :P
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Neil on April 05, 2007, 08:58:18 AM: One problem with Bugs is the lack of through wires on some models. Personally seen one big Gt lost when loop pulled out of moulding!!! Beware.

Neil
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Luke Wyrsta on April 08, 2007, 06:59:53 PM: Quote from: Brandon on April 04, 2007, 08:06:32 AM

You're experimenting with a 50/50 combination? I haven't thought of that but it makes some sense! Would you run the treble off the back of on the middle?

Here is a Mega Pop rigged:

(http://img201.imageshack.us/img201/3673/megapopjl0.jpg)
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Brandon Khoo on April 08, 2007, 07:35:28 PM: That Mega Pop is a seriously angry looking lure. If I remember correctly, they're something like 200grams, aren't they? With the hooks you've got on, that beastie has got to be something like 230grams!!! You'd be $#!@# after about a dozen casts with that thing - and to make things worse, that's a pencil popper too so you need to work it pretty fast.

Mmmmm..... 200 grams + working fast :o

I'd struggle working a stickbait that big!!
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Luke Wyrsta on April 08, 2007, 08:29:05 PM: Quote from: Brandon on April 08, 2007, 07:35:28 PM
That Mega Pop is a seriously angry looking lure. If I remember correctly, they're something like 200grams, aren't they? With the hooks you've got on, that beastie has got to be something like 230grams!!! You'd be $#!@# after about a dozen casts with that thing - and to make things worse, that's a pencil popper too so you need to work it pretty fast.

Mmmmm..... 200 grams + working fast :o

I'd struggle working a stickbait that big!!

That it is Brandon, this is only ever brought out for a dozen casts in BIG GT territory.

The good thing about this popper, despite it being a pencil, you can still work it slower like a chugger/blooper because the cup is so large! It glides and then does a big dump of water....looks awesome but as you said, very laborious!
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Luke Wyrsta on April 08, 2007, 08:42:21 PM: For those who haven't seen one, this is a Bill's Bug:

(http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/2746/billsbugdu7.jpg)

(http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/3052/megapopcupjs3.jpg)
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Greg Burt on April 08, 2007, 10:02:11 PM: I can't see how you can catch anything on that Mega Pop, its that scary and mean looking it would even scare Doggies away. :o
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Brandon Khoo on April 08, 2007, 10:05:17 PM: the workmanship on the Bills Bug is every bit as bad as i remember!!
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: George Pang on April 08, 2007, 10:55:56 PM: As the others have said, a bit rough in the finish. But great popping action! A really big boof for a relatively small popper and can bring up the fish. Easy to cast, and pop all day long and relatively hard wearing.

Neil has warned me about the possiblity of it pulling out, but I have wired poppers snap on the wire!

I posted some pics of fish that fallen for the bug and a snapped wired river2sea.

Cheers
George
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Luke Wyrsta on April 08, 2007, 11:03:38 PM: Some great photos there George 8). I am yet to see a wire snap, wow :o I seem to recall you got a 35kg off Frasier on a Bill's Bug a while back?

You may like to let us know a bit more about the crimps you are using. I know some of the others members and brandon would be keen to see how/what you are using.
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: George Pang on April 29, 2007, 09:02:05 PM: Luke, I just use a thimble and crimps with shrink wrap over them, to reduce flash and wahoo mischief. I do short bite leader with a crimp and shrinkwrap over that as well.

As brandon eluded to, I had some issues with the bug as shoalwater.

I had to retire one of my favourite bugs, as the belly loop had been pulled at an angle. So I put another, newer bug on. It didnt seem to pop like the old one and seemed a bit heavy, unable to float a Decoy 8/0. So I checked out the other bugs.
The newer ones are heavier, two 116g, two 118g and one 120g. The older ones with twisted wire loops weighed 102g, 104g, 106g.

So I decided to weigh the hooks with rings which gave interesting results
Trebles
Decoy 8/0 24g
GT recorder 6/0 20g
ST76 5/0 22g

Singles
Owner Jobu 10/0 16g (recommended by nomad)
Decoy Sergeant N 8/0 8g
Gama Livebait 8/0 12g
Decoy Cutlass 10/0 10g

Blade 8g

It becomes apparent when you are trying to getthe best popping action how important the balance of lure is. My old bug popped fantastically, but the newer bugs need a different setup, maybe two single sergeant'N will give back the balance.

Cheers
George
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Brandon Khoo on April 30, 2007, 08:45:45 PM: George - you didn't try the bug with a single during the trip, did you?

I also cannot deny that the Bills Bug has got to be about the best lure for the money you can get. They get a great pop and while their finish isn't fantastic, they GTs hardly care about that. Beautiful finishes like the top of the line Japanese poppers are designed to catch the fisherman and they do a damn good job of it!! ;D
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Luke Wyrsta on May 09, 2007, 07:32:24 PM: Great informative post George, Thanks! :D
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Brandon Khoo on May 11, 2007, 07:27:35 PM: I just received a small number of Bills Bugs from Mo Tackle in Coffs Harbour. They cheap as chips compared to most other poppers out there. They obviously moulded but the new models feel heavy for the size.

I think George is right - putting a big treble onto this won't work as they will sink and won't work properly. They may need a relatively light single like a Decoy Sergeant. Btw - I am a broken record player but the finish is disgraceful!!
Title: Re: Bills Bugs
Post by: Brandon Khoo on May 14, 2007, 09:29:56 PM: here George - here is a picture to make you happy - 4 bugs!!

(http://i174.photobucket.com/albums/w95/berniek/IMGP4350.jpg)