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Topwater Caranx Ignobilis: Giant Trevally (GT) => Tackle & Techniques => Topic started by: Stuart Rowley on October 01, 2014, 01:15:07 PM

Title: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Stuart Rowley on October 01, 2014, 01:15:07 PM
Great thread Brandon Khoo, very informative. I asked this on the FB page, so sorry if its doubling up.  I would like to do Land based GT fishing so if anyone could give me some advice it would be much appreciated. I live in Perth WA, will be fishing LandBased locations up north for GTs, Quobba, Exmouth, Broom, etc etc. Not to sure but I guess I would be using mostly Poppers around the 120 - 160g mark & some stick baits, not sure of the weights there, I guess about 150-170g range, but will use what suits the rod I end up with. So for a rod I was thinking that the - Endless Passion EP 86/40R-P, may be a good choice. Casting distance would be a big factor so I thought this may be the overall best choice between lure weight & rod length. What do you guys think? Is there a better rod for this application? Have also been looking into the BLACK HOLE CAPE COD SPECIAL 106N HEAVY ROD (NANO), Any advice on these two rods or others would be much appreciated. Thank you.
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Brandon Khoo on October 01, 2014, 06:55:15 PM
Guys, Stewart posted this question on FB originally and I suggested he might be better off asking this question on gtpopping. Hoping some of our Hawaiian members who have experience in this form of GT fishing might be able to offer some insights.
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Saltywater Tackle on October 01, 2014, 11:25:44 PM
Hi Stuart,
I suggest you to take look into the following rods for your application:
Runner Exceed Final Stand Up 100SXH http://www.saltywatertackle.com/home/runner-exceed-final-stand-up-1047.html
MC Works Raging Bull RB100XR-2http://www.saltywatertackle.com/high-end-jigging-surfing-casting-and-popping-rods/mc-works-raging-bull-rb100xr-2-1006.html (http://www.saltywatertackle.com/high-end-jigging-surfing-casting-and-popping-rods/mc-works-raging-bull-rb100xr-2-1006.html)

 Tight lines
   Sami
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Stuart Rowley on October 02, 2014, 10:25:14 PM
Thanks guys. I will have a look at these rods. Cheers
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Cameron Mundy on October 03, 2014, 01:03:12 AM
My RacePoint 200 out casts my Endless Passion 86/40 in all lure weights its hard to beat a fast action rod for distance. I fish both with either a 18k or 14k and pe8, if you droped to a 10k /8k and pe6 you gain even more distance.
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Gerhard Delport on October 07, 2014, 03:53:31 AM
I have the Blackhole 106H.

I use it for Spanish Mack and Queens from the bricks.

The rod handles a 150g Cubera popper with a smile and launch it a long way.

I have matched it with the Stella 10 or 14K with PE 6-8.

You can also look at the Blackhole 8.6 nano if you need a bit more backbone to handle a GT from the bricks
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Clem Henry on October 07, 2014, 09:36:39 AM
Stuart

I believe that CTS has 2 blanks designed in conjunction with Nathan at GTFC - 10' and 11' respectively. Can be found on the CTS site along with pics in action etc also on FB

I am about to order a 10'...
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Craig Maree on October 07, 2014, 01:14:38 PM
I have the Blackhole 106H.

I use it for Spanish Mack and Queens from the bricks.

The rod handles a 150g Cubera popper with a smile and launch it a long way.

I have matched it with the Stella 10 or 14K with PE 6-8.

You can also look at the Blackhole 8.6 nano if you need a bit more backbone to handle a GT from the bricks

Gerhard when you say a a Cubera 150 a long way, I am looking for a longer rod to get extra distance.

I would be very interested in what distance you are getting on this set up, any chance of measuring your casts on a field.

As they say, Om te MEET is om te WEET, Guestimates don't provide true reflections of stats






Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Gerhard Delport on October 07, 2014, 02:26:26 PM
I have the Blackhole 106H.

I use it for Spanish Mack and Queens from the bricks.

The rod handles a 150g Cubera popper with a smile and launch it a long way.

I have matched it with the Stella 10 or 14K with PE 6-8.

You can also look at the Blackhole 8.6 nano if you need a bit more backbone to handle a GT from the bricks

Gerhard when you say a a Cubera 150 a long way, I am looking for a longer rod to get extra distance.

I would be very interested in what distance you are getting on this set up, any chance of measuring your casts on a field.

As they say, Om te MEET is om te WEET, Guestimates don't provide true reflections of stats

Craig,

I am flying back to Saudi today.

I will make a couple of casts on the soccer field at the construction camp somewhere the next week.

Its difficult guestemating distance on water but I can confirm I land the 150g past the 1,5-2 oz lures casted by the a fellow angler using a 11ft Amia.

The 106H has been called a noodle stick by some of the guys here for GT's from the rocks I have yet to experience this....
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Craig Maree on October 07, 2014, 05:52:00 PM
Thanks Gerhard

I was casting a 11 Ft Amia the other day on the Rugby Field and was getting around 105 to 110m with 20lbs braid.

What LBS braid are you casting with the BH?

Let me know once you have tested on the soccer field.
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Nathan Tsao on October 13, 2014, 01:20:36 PM
Howzit Stuart,

For the shoreline GT fishing you intend to do, and with the lure ratings that you are interested in, there are a couple good options. I suppose the best place to start would be to ask how aggressively do you like to fight your fish from the rocks?

If you're the kind of guy who wants to hook up to 20kilo GTs and crank em in with no drag taken out, then i would suggest the PD Rockfist or the United Composites 100XXH. Both of these sticks have an ideal lure range of 150g-180g and an awesome amount of power down low for vertical lift in deep water. The UC has a bit slower tip section, but more power in the tail than the PD Rockfist XTX115. These are more popper rods than stickbait rods. I like them with 180-230g stickbaits like Ulua 200's and Bigfoot 230's. They can do a 150g stickbait, but you gotta go easier on them.   

If you're looking to throw smaller lures, and fish a little less aggressively, then that opens up your options a bit more. The MC Works 106XX is nice with lures 100-140g, the Ripple Fisher Runner Exceed is pretty similar, and the Zenaq 100HHH is nice too. Each of these rods is a little less powerful than i care to fish where i live, but really light and sweet. These are all great for both lighter poppers and medium stickbaits.

I respectfully disagree with Gerhard about the Black Hole 106N Heavy. I built a couple and found them entirely too soft for GT fishing. 60g-90g is nice casting on this rod, but the backbone just isn't there to get dirty with big fish.

As Clem mentioned above; I have worked with CTS to develop a line of Hawaiian Shoreline Specific GT rods, that have been designed for hardcore fishing on nasty lava rock terrain. We have three models available ranging from an "All Around" rod to an "Absolutely Ridiculous" rod. We have had awesome results with them so far.

Hope this helps you out in your pursuit for a good land based rig. My group of fishing buddies over here has just about every shoreline GT rod ever made, and we have put everything to the test side by side. Shoreline GT's are a niche fishery within a niche fishery, so its nice to have some input with the complete range of whats available out there before making a big purchase.

Aloha
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Anton Haakman on October 15, 2014, 04:55:08 AM
@ Craig. What is your target species? What reel will you be fishing, what lure weight and what line class. I have a few land based rods in varying weights so should be able to provide some input. Is casting distance your primary factor? For distance my two best set ups are my Yamaga Blue Sniper 10ftH and a Graphcast 5 built for multiplier fished with magged Trina 16a and 50lbs Jerry Brown with 7m mono leader. Best cast weight for Yamaga 60 - 80g and then 100 - 120 for GC 5. I have not measured accurately but both will exceed 120m. I have played golf off scratch for 23 years so I do not think that I am that far out with my distance estimates.

The minute I go to heavier set ups distance reduces dramatically. I have a 9ft6 Phenix Black Diamond blank that has just been finished but I have yet to collect it. This blank felt as though it would cast very well but I will only know after the weekend.

If ever you make it to Cape Town you are welcome to test a few set ups.

Kind regards
Anton
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Craig Maree on October 15, 2014, 10:37:24 AM
Hi Anton thanks for the post, looking to a land based GT rod for 60lbs to 100lbs JB braid mainly chisel once plugs which assists in distance vs a popper.

A while ago I was testing rods for casting distance on the nearby rugby field trying to find out the difference in casting distance between different rod lengths and setups (spinning vs overhead). For some land based and boat based areas around heavy surf the extra distance means the difference between strikes and no action.

My test showed that

80m casting distance on Temple Reef GT 80-10 (Pathfinder) Stella 10k SW /SOM 16k spool loaded with JBH 100lbs casting 120g chisel nose plug.

85m casting distance on a Shimano 10ft rod with the same reel and lure above.

100m casting distance with a 9ft6 CD Graphcast 5  and a Daiwa overhead reel 40 Saltist Levelwind with 18kg mono and the above lure. I think I would extra distance on a overhead with braid?

95m casting distance on Temple Reef GT 80-10 (Pathfinder) Stella 10k SW spool loaded with JB 60lbs casting 120g chisel nose plug.

So a extra 15m or so on the 60lbs vs the 100lbs braid.

Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Anton Haakman on October 15, 2014, 05:39:15 PM
You would definitely add some distance with braid on the multiplier. It is the difference between casting .40mm and casting .70mm. Also great advantages with leaders as knots can be very small - FG or Bob Sands. I use this for tail at St Francis. - not quite 50 -100lbs GTs but it is as close as we come in SA. I fish 80lbs JB hollow stitched into a 10m 200lbs braid leader connected to a heavy mono or 80lbs fireline leader with FG knot. I use either the Trini 16 a or Trini DC 20.

Fitted adjustable magnetic cast control into the A for R300 and it took less than 3 min to do at home with a cordless drill.

Back to the rods. This is a very narrow brief and there are not many that I know of that will handle the upper limits of this. I have 2 rods that will give you a chance in the lower to middle of this range. The MC Works Raging Bull 100 XR2 capable of 13 kg drag and then I have 2 x GC 5's built for spinning reels. I fish Rooikrans a lot and have lifted many 7-8kg ytail 3-5m from the water onto the ledge. I have the older dark blue ones and they are near bullet proof.

The rods that Nathan lists is the other thread look promising. I have an 8ft CTS that I got from New Zealand and use for Ytail off of the boat. They were a pleasure to deal with and it is a fantastic rod. Rated PE 3 but it has taken yfin to 40kg with ease.

In reasonable terrain you should have a chance with most of these rods. That said the rods Nathan is building are 100% purpose built. It seems that CTS will also sell these blanks. Maybe import 1or 2 and get the Alcocks to build them up for you. Could be a bit better than trying to get the rods here from Hawaii?

Good luck
Anton
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Craig Maree on October 17, 2014, 03:37:50 AM
Anton I also have an original old blue GC 5 from Dave Alcock.

I also have the Shimano Exage 11ft and 10ft rods built for Yellowtail (Kingfish).

How do these compare to the Mc Works in casting distance and pull power?

Looking at mainly using chisel nose plugs to increase casting distance.

Picked up my Shimano Tranx today, monster size baitcaster.  It feels very balanced on the GC 5, going to load it with braid and give it a cast.
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Craig Maree on October 17, 2014, 03:40:37 AM
Gerhard you had any chance to cast the BH on the soccer field?
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Gerhard Delport on October 17, 2014, 03:46:07 AM
Nope,

Will be hunting fish in the morning from the bricks.

The Exage and the Trini 16 will also get a chance with a plug or spoon
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Anton Haakman on October 17, 2014, 04:27:07 AM
The Tranx could be a winner. From what I have heard the internals are very similar to the Trini A series with the added benefit of the level wind.

The MC works outcasts the GC5's that I have had built for spinning reels. It may sound strange but for casting distance I find a big difference between 9ft6 and 10ft. The MC Works is rated to 11 kg drag and my guess is that drag capability of the GC 5 would be fairly similar.

I saw the new Assasin Sierra rod today. Very nice rod. It should handle fish in the lower end of your range with ease. It is 11 ft which I personally find a little long but this rod will cast miles. The construction of this rod is as good as rods double or triple it's price. I really is a nice looking piece of kit.

I will be very keen to hear your results with the Tranx.
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Gerhard Delport on October 17, 2014, 06:08:15 PM
The GT Ice cream 3oz with a Trini 16 loaded with 30lbs tuff line, on a 11Ft Shimano Exage is an absolute beautiful match casting into the wind from the bricks....

The queenfish was happy to grab the plug ...

(http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y62/Jakkals/imagejpg1_zps6521865e.jpg) (http://s3.photobucket.com/user/Jakkals/media/imagejpg1_zps6521865e.jpg.html)
 
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Felix Lux on October 17, 2014, 06:13:49 PM
Very nice Gerhard!

I have a few questions regarding your setup please:

How does the thin 30lb braid go? No problems getting your thumb burned or problems with overruns? Do you get the same distance as with say 20lb mono?

Thank you mate! :)
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Gerhard Delport on October 18, 2014, 10:46:21 PM
Very nice Gerhard!

I have a few questions regarding your setup please:

How does the thin 30lb braid go? No problems getting your thumb burned or problems with overruns? Do you get the same distance as with say 20lb mono?

Thank you mate! :)

I definatley out cast my spinning reel setups when it comes to casting into the wind like it was yesterday.
The Tuff Line casts great but I would load up on 50lb Power Pro when its time for new braid.
No issues with thumb burns and if you set the weight on the Trini correctly there is no over runs over winds...

The setup did very well with 80g spoons as well.
The reel is fast enough to keep a plug on the surface or a spoon going at speed just under the surface without many issues...

You will not be able to put the same power into a cast with a 3-4oz with 20lb mono...

Here is the video clip of the fight...



Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Felix Lux on October 20, 2014, 01:49:14 PM
Thank you. I've never tried casting braid on OH gear...would love say 10m of mono and the rest braid, to have the perfect balance between stretch and hookset.

Do you need less or more braking when using braid?

Sorry the questions might be very basic, but here in Australia all people casting with OH gear for tuna, mackerel etc. use mono. Which I found has a few big disadvantages (also advantages of course), compared to spinning reel setups.

PS: Great video, music is not what you'd expect on a fishing video, but pretty cool somehow.
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Gerhard Delport on October 20, 2014, 04:13:41 PM
Thanks for the comments on the video.

I have a leader double the rod length with a couple of turns left on the reel.

I use a PR Knot and for someone who hates casting with a knot running trough the gides the PR knot is perfect, you dont feel or hear it hitting the giudes during the cast.

You will have problems casting with braid if you have an birds nest during the cast.

Because of the power you put into the rod the braid will snap (30lbs) if you have a brids nest.

You need to be a provisioned overhead caster before going to braid on the reel.
Then you need to ensure the reel is set for each lure to prevent a birds nest.

I am casting for Queenfish and Mackerels from the rocks but I will enjoy getting to target tuna or Gt's with this setup as well...
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Craig Maree on October 21, 2014, 12:38:03 AM
Which setup do you cast further the Trini overheard setup or the BH spinning setup with the 150 Cubera?
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Gerhard Delport on October 21, 2014, 12:45:46 AM
Which setup do you cast further the Trini overheard setup or the BH spinning setup with the 150 Cubera?

I have to cast them side by side on a soccer field.

I am getting ready for a business trip to Singapore, might not be able to test it before I fly.

Also its difficult to compare as its 30lb tuff line on the OH with 100lb on the spinning reel.

I would like to try and pop a popper with the OH to see how it works...
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Craig Maree on October 21, 2014, 04:23:06 AM
From your judgement from casting both setups which do you think you getting more distance on?

The BH spinnng setup with 150 Cubera or the Trini OH setup with the 3oz GT ice cream?
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Gerhard Delport on October 21, 2014, 04:49:44 AM
From your judgement from casting both setups which do you think you getting more distance on?

The BH spinnng setup with 150 Cubera or the Trini OH setup with the 3oz GT ice cream?

Craig,

It looks like I might get to fish on Friday and fly on Saturday.

I will take both the rods and cast ...

I will ask the guys who fish with me to judge what setup gets the most distance but I suspect it will be the OH.

I will use the Stella 10K with JB Hollow 60lb on the BH 106 H to cast the Cubera and compare...
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Craig Maree on October 21, 2014, 02:23:55 PM
Thanks Gerhard
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Felix Lux on October 21, 2014, 03:47:03 PM
Thanks for the comments on the video.

I have a leader double the rod length with a couple of turns left on the reel.

I use a PR Knot and for someone who hates casting with a knot running trough the gides the PR knot is perfect, you dont feel or hear it hitting the giudes during the cast.

You will have problems casting with braid if you have an birds nest during the cast.

Because of the power you put into the rod the braid will snap (30lbs) if you have a brids nest.

You need to be a provisioned overhead caster before going to braid on the reel.
Then you need to ensure the reel is set for each lure to prevent a birds nest.

I am casting for Queenfish and Mackerels from the rocks but I will enjoy getting to target tuna or Gt's with this setup as well...

Thank you!

I'm ok in OH casting, but definitely wouldn't say good. Still regularly get light to medium bad overruns when giving it a hard 95-100% cast. So I'll better put another 100 hours of practise in, before I try braid.

Would you say 30-50lb braid casts further than 20lb mono?
And would you think 40lb JB hollow is a good option, or does it not cast as well on OH gear? You could get an even slimmer and stronger connection inserting 40-50lb leader directly into the hollow, then serving the splice (tried that myself on spin gear) + use a heavier bite leader if desired, similar to Nathan's GT setup. You could also just splice a new section of line, if you loose too much or damage some line.
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Gerhard Delport on October 21, 2014, 08:23:07 PM
Felix,

Start casting a plug and spoon with the OH gear and you will soon have enough casting practise... lol

You can not compare 20lb mono with 30lb braid.

Braid will win everytine.

If I could choose...

I would probably load with 60lb JB Hollow and splice in a 10m 100lb JH Hollow "leader" and then a nylon leader of roughly double the length of the rod.

This would give you all the power and line capacity to handle some big fish on the OH gear...

But you need to determine what species and size fish you will be targeting.

If its fish like queen's and spanish mackerel i would go 40lb with 80lb leader in JB Hollow.

The seceret is to have a balanced outfit for what you want to target.

Hope this helps.
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Anton Haakman on October 21, 2014, 08:46:59 PM
Another rod to throw into this mix is the Majorcraft KG Evolution Shore Jigging rod 10ft HH.

There was a report by Blaasoppie - Mark - on a trip to St Francis where he tested two of these rods with Dennis Swannell. The report is on 360Tuna. Dennis loved them and he know a fair amount about fishing.

If I recall Mark's comment it was something to the effect that he thought the rod should have no difficulty handling a GT of 30-40kg.

There is the added bonus that they are very well priced.
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Felix Lux on October 21, 2014, 11:10:19 PM
Felix,

Start casting a plug and spoon with the OH gear and you will soon have enough casting practise... lol

You can not compare 20lb mono with 30lb braid.

Braid will win everytine.

If I could choose...

I would probably load with 60lb JB Hollow and splice in a 10m 100lb JH Hollow "leader" and then a nylon leader of roughly double the length of the rod.

This would give you all the power and line capacity to handle some big fish on the OH gear...

But you need to determine what species and size fish you will be targeting.

If its fish like queen's and spanish mackerel i would go 40lb with 80lb leader in JB Hollow.

The seceret is to have a balanced outfit for what you want to target.

Hope this helps.

Helps quite a lot Gerhard, legend!

Casting metal jigs with it, like Spanyid Raiders and similar. For casting plugs hmmmm...unless it's a stable flying plug like a GT ice cream or pencil popper I wouldn't even think about it and go straight to my trusty spinning reel gear haha! Just doing this to broaden my horizon a bit and have fun. Although I do think for some situations and types of fishing there can be advantages in using overhead gear.
And I want to get good at it of course, otherwise no point. Will try braid next season for sure.

Target species would be Longtail Tuna, Kingfish (yellowtail) and sometimes Spanish Mackerel, so basically 40lb mainline is more than enough except for the larger kingfish that will burry you, but I've got heavy spin gear for them.




Re the Majorcraft KG Evolution series I can attest to them being nice rods, unbeatable value for money. A friend of mine had the HH, but I never casted that one, so can't tell how strong it is. Probably similar to the heavy Yamaga Blue Sniper Shore Jigging Anton?
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: IggiJacques on December 27, 2016, 05:56:57 AM
Assassin sierra 2xh and assassin spinmaster 2xh both good rods for shore distance. We fish sierra 2xh on gosa 10k 50lbs braid. 100lbs casting braid leader about two rod lengths. 1.5 meters 1mm mono leader to swivel split ring. These rods beasts for distance and power. I love em
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Brian Haybittle on March 25, 2017, 06:04:11 AM
Any experience with Hamachi Gt and Doggie rods? I got a 10ft three piece to travel with. Seems nice and heavy. Going to pair up with a cheap daiwa Nero 6500 (ordered line roller bearing and carbon drag)
I want to cast poppers and stickbait from shore for GTs while in Samoa and Raro. Then stickbait while in NZ for Kingis
Also occasionally to cast big break our sinkers for slide baiting for kingfish.

I see they are sold from Perth. Will keep you updated
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT rod
Post by: Greg Callan on May 10, 2017, 08:33:09 AM
Have a look at the Tenryu Powermaster I have 9'6" Heavy core  teamed with Stella 14000 Pe 5 Varivas.SMP cast 60 g Shimano Ocea pencils 75m and DAIWA TG BAITS [tungsten jig] 90m rod loads easy and casts without hurting you at the end of a session
Title: Re: Advice on land based GT ro
Post by: Samuel Shaw on September 02, 2017, 08:46:51 AM
I'm a strictly land based GT/Ulua fisherman here in Hawaii.
For popping/stickbait I use 2 poles. The Tsunami Airwave Elite is a 11' two peice pole rated 20-40lb (I use 60lb hollow core braid) Lure rating 1.5-4.5 oz
I have landed 40 lb with this rod. Can handle a bigger fish easily. About 250.00 when I bought it.
This rod surprised me

When I want to lock my drag down my favorite rod is the CTS GT Fight 11'0'' 60lb-80lb / up to 4oz lures
I use 100lb hollow Core on this set up. Picked up for about 400

Both are hooked with a Stella Sw 10000. Powerpro Hollow Core. Served connection to 100-150lb flouro