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Topwater Caranx Ignobilis: Giant Trevally (GT) => Tackle & Techniques => Topic started by: Luke Wyrsta on March 11, 2007, 07:21:49 PM

Title: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Luke Wyrsta on March 11, 2007, 07:21:49 PM
What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?

I am often asked what is the best popping style/action for a particular species or area. I think it would be useful if we had discussion about this topic and perhaps came to some conclusions on what works and what doesn't.

We all know that there are many techniques to target GTs of different size, in different areas and with different type surface lures...please share some of your thoughts. This could be used for some kind of fact file or information page on the main GTPopping.com website.

Cheers,
Luke
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Jon Li on March 11, 2007, 10:31:11 PM
Hi Luke ,

Upon arriving in an area ;

If it's deep water around the rocks then my choise of lures would be chugger and stickbait , however if the sea is somewhat choppy then chugger is out and stickbait is my main choice . If it's shallow reef / sand banks then my choise would be pencil popper and chugger , again when there is chop then pencil popper will be my choise and may even try stickbait . Colour of lures is not important but flashes in stickbait is of the utmost important so pelagic fish can see it from a distance away . Less than clear water warrant noisy lures and the bigger size may work better than the smaller one .

For these I have a specific rod for each task , for chugger I use short rod with stiff tip , for pencil popper I use long rod with stiff tip and for stickbait I use rod with sensitive tip . I prefer as light a reel as possible with retrieve speed of minimum 1m per turn of handle filled with 200 m of 80 lbs ~ 100 lbs braided line for GT fishing and 300m of 60 lbs ~ 80 lbs braided line for YFT .

I hardly use lures heavier than 125 gr. , my main concerns are reaching the target as accurately as possible each time I cast and the longer distance I can cast but still accurately the better it is . I prefer to have a strike for every cast but that is not possible so , yes as few cast and as many strike as possible !

I like to use thin main leader + 15 cm of thick " bite " leader , my GT leader would be 120 mono leader and my YFT leader would be 100 lbs mono leader , these will be connected to 180 lbs fluorocarbon leader . The length of my leader is double the distance from spool to rod tip , this is necessary because I cast from the bow of the boat which can be as high as 2 m above the water level .

For chugger I use sideway stroke n retrieve from the moment the lure hit the water till the end of the retrieve , with pencil popper I hold the tip of the rod high and stroke it while retrieving continuously , with stickbait I twitch and retrive with rod tip pointed somewhat lower than sideway stroking .

The best way to learn GT fishing is to fish along a more accomplished anglers , if a picture worth a thousand words then a movie worth a million words and meanwhile fishing in the real world with  accomplished anglers must be worth a zillion words .

Jon .




Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Brandon Khoo on March 12, 2007, 08:47:31 PM
John summed it up really well. There is no better way to learn than to fish alongside an accomplished angler. You learn more in one short session than all the reading you can do.

I am finding that I am reaching more and more for the stickbait as my first choice now. Once you get the technique right, it is a far more forgiving lure on your body to fish with than poppers. Chuggers, especially the big chuggers like the big hammerheads will wear you out in relatively short time. Pencil poppers which tend to be my second choice are great as they are easy to work but you still need to wind pretty fast and if you have a 20000 Stella instead of a 10000 or a Dogfight, you'll get pretty tired!

I carry stickbaits for all conditions now (John - your Herus are a great all round stickbait for all conditions).
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Andrew Poulos on March 12, 2007, 09:43:12 PM
Has anyone seen the dvd by carpenter...hope its good as i just ordered it. I haven't used my stickbaits that much yet, but mainly the cup faced variety. I stab the rod tip down or work it sideways to get the spray and blooping going. I haven't been too impressed with the pencil poppers I have so far and am trying to work out the best conditions for them. I have only used them in rough seas and they were all over the place.
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Brandon Khoo on March 12, 2007, 10:03:14 PM
Has anyone seen the dvd by carpenter...hope its good as i just ordered it. I haven't used my stickbaits that much yet, but mainly the cup faced variety. I stab the rod tip down or work it sideways to get the spray and blooping going. I haven't been too impressed with the pencil poppers I have so far and am trying to work out the best conditions for them. I have only used them in rough seas and they were all over the place.


 ;D  sorry Andrew. i don't mean to be laughing but your post above was just really funny. You haven't been impressed with the pencil poppers because they are all over the place in rough seas.

Well, you don't really use pencil poppers in conditions like that! They're not designed for it. Pencil poppers work best in relatively calm conditions when they are highly visible skipping along the surface. In rough conditions, it is very hard to get tha skipping motion and also, there will be too much chop and white water for them to be visible.
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Andrew Poulos on March 12, 2007, 10:09:10 PM
Yeah, I know.Still learning how to best work some of these. I knew they would be better in calmer conditions but thought that they would also work in some rougher conditions but I was wrong. And I have only had rough conditions to play with so far. The ones I used were the saltiga ones that have the gill slits. I also have the surface cruisers and like those more so far but again, better when less chop around.
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Luke Wyrsta on March 12, 2007, 10:35:18 PM
Yeah, I know.Still learning how to best work some of these. I knew they would be better in calmer conditions but thought that they would also work in some rougher conditions but I was wrong. And I have only had rough conditions to play with so far. The ones I used were the saltiga ones that have the gill slits. I also have the surface cruisers and like those more so far but again, better when less chop around.

Brandon is right, but they can still be used in the rougher conditions. Although not ideal for the conditions, depending on what kind of pencil you use, they can provide a welcome change and induce a strike when nothing else is working.

The key to using the pencil is when anything that slightly resembles chop/roughness is to keep the lure in the water....as long as it isn't flying out off each crest, it will still attract those fish. Add some pauses for a more dramatic effect and time with the conditions....i've had big GTs come up and sniper it in the couple of seconds after a pause.

Each and every angler has their own opinions, that's simply mine as i have had success with them in the rough stuff.
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Brandon Khoo on March 13, 2007, 08:02:39 AM
actually, my statement was a generalisation. There are some pencils which can be used in rough water but you will find these are made heavy so they stay down a bit better in the chop. Plat make a pencil which is over 200grams which is bloody heavy which would be suitable. I've got one but I haven't used it. I am worried about getting a hernia from casting it!

The lighter pencils get tossed all over the place by the waves. If you were a GT and you saw one of these, you'd have to to wonder whether that fish was too uncoordinated to eat.


Yeah, I know.Still learning how to best work some of these. I knew they would be better in calmer conditions but thought that they would also work in some rougher conditions but I was wrong. And I have only had rough conditions to play with so far. The ones I used were the saltiga ones that have the gill slits. I also have the surface cruisers and like those more so far but again, better when less chop around.

Brandon is right, but they can still be used in the rougher conditions. Although not ideal for the conditions, depending on what kind of pencil you use, they can provide a welcome change and induce a strike when nothing else is working.

The key to using the pencil is when anything that slightly resembles chop/roughness is to keep the lure in the water....as long as it isn't flying out off each crest, it will still attract those fish. Add some pauses for a more dramatic effect and time with the conditions....i've had big GTs come up and sniper it in the couple of seconds after a pause.

Each and every angler has their own opinions, that's simply mine as i have had success with them in the rough stuff.
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Andrew Poulos on March 13, 2007, 08:37:48 AM
The ones I was referring to are these saltiga pencils

http://www.daiwa.com/Lure/lures_saltiga.aspx

I have the 18cm size and some of the smaller ones too. And also have some of their slider lures too. Just noticed Nomad has an online tackle section too now....
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Brandon Khoo on March 13, 2007, 10:14:20 PM
I think the little saltiga pencil is a bit too light for rough conditions, Andrew
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Andrew Poulos on March 14, 2007, 08:49:20 AM
The little ones are 30grams rigged and the 18cm ones about 85grams. Not really up there with the GT lure weights.
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Luke Wyrsta on March 14, 2007, 04:41:38 PM
The little ones are 30grams rigged and the 18cm ones about 85grams. Not really up there with the GT lure weights.

You can say that again :o
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Andrew Poulos on March 14, 2007, 10:10:17 PM
The little ones I use for bonnies and salmon to have some fun off the rocks. The larger ones hoping for a nice kingie...I cant go much more than 100 grams at the moment with the 80TN, so am a bit limited. When I get the next rod for the higher weights will be getting some heavier stickbaits to add to the collection.
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: gtmad on March 23, 2007, 11:33:54 AM
In Fiji the most sucessful lure for the trip was the 210mm River to sea dumbell in all colors, especially the mackeral green and Blue. We also used the haymakers and also took quality fish but they take there toll on your arms after a few hours.

No.1 action was big bloops closely followed by blooping at high speed working the rod nice and high.
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Brandon Khoo on March 23, 2007, 01:11:33 PM
did the dumbbell stand up to the fishing? They have such a thin neck that I worry about it breaking at that point
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Sachin Chaudhry on April 03, 2007, 08:47:00 AM
In Fiji the most sucessful lure for the trip was the 210mm River to sea dumbell in all colors, especially the mackeral green and Blue. We also used the haymakers and also took quality fish but they take there toll on your arms after a few hours.

No.1 action was big bloops closely followed by blooping at high speed working the rod nice and high.
Joe, interesting to note that the dumbells worked so well for you in Fiji. I use mainly pencil poppers here in Fiji (actually almost always use pencils).
The ones I tend to use are Zest Pencil Poppers which are around 8 inches long (110 grams) and the Surecatch GT which tip the scales at 120 grams with standard rigging . I replace the standard trebles with Mustad doubles and find the hook up rates to be around 80% out of all strikes. The Mustads never seem to straighten and also helps me to eliminate the split rings from the equation. Also have a selection of homemade pencil poppers which also work quite well. That being said I have seen some nice fish taken on Halco Haymakers and River 2 Sea Dumbells. Personally I feel it is much easier to get more action out of pencils and by being narrow at the front you can work them in more ways that a large cupped blooper. Horses for courses I suppose.
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Peter Lowe on April 28, 2007, 08:27:06 PM
Gotta love the old River to Sea jobs.....

They do get chewed up/split after a few big one's but ya gotta love that.....  ;D[img]
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Johan de Vlieger on February 01, 2008, 09:33:16 AM
Before I fished the first time on Gt's my targets were tarpons, jack crevalle, leerfish, barra's, ...
The type of popping action I used in the Atlantic was mostly the same : for all the mentioned fish (except for tarpon) a relatively rapid retrieve with big splashes and that almost everytime did the job.
First time I targetted GT's was in Mauritius where the local captain of a charter introduced me to this more extreme way of fishing poppers.
The way of fishing was more demanding : throwing harder, retrieving faster, a lot faster...
That's the way I adapted it and it was also the way I tought you had to fish GT's.
Now I know better : sometimes this very fast retrieving of the popper does still work but the slower way with a lot of splashing and pauzes also works, or the "walking the dog" just beneath the surface.
Conclusion : you have to adjust your way of fishing regarding the time, place and situation your in.
Always fishing the same motion with the same lures is missing a great deal of fish.
At least : that's my opinion !  ;D
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Dayne J-W on March 11, 2008, 08:48:40 PM
Quote
have the 18cm size and some of the smaller ones too. And also have some of their slider lures too. Just noticed Nomad has an online tackle section too now....

speaking of nomads tackle does anyone know how it performs outside of there "secret" reefs that seem to be overflowing with big GT's ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Graham Scott on June 20, 2008, 09:59:59 PM
Good old river to sea dumbell has been working well along the CQ coast up towards Shoalwater Bay. Although half the price seems a better action in rough water than the Captiva.
Last trip I was the dumbell...mucking around with all the 10 kg queenfish only to get cleaned up by a big GT while dreaming away....next dumbell please.....bugger
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Aaron Concord on July 15, 2008, 11:06:46 PM
It's all about timing...Chucking surface lures is a VERY specialised form of fishing.
Whether it's a blooper, chugger, fizzer, stickbait or pencil, it's all about looking at the water during the retrieve and how the lure is performing in each trough or crest of a wave.
Anyone can keep a pencil in the drink in flat water, or make a blooper work without tumbling in calm stuff, though I have seen too many anglers who aren't aware of what the water is doing to the action of the lure....this is AFTER they have chosen a lure that SHOULD work in chop or swell or over current washed flats. They've made a great decision, though watching their retrieve and their timing goes out the window!
Rythmn takes over and then the lure flies off a crest or sinks in a trough, wasting the retrieve and a possible GT strike.
I make sure I can alter my retrieve to suit the convoluted water that GT's love. And have an intimate knowledge of the type of lure that best fits the water being fished.
My general rules are: popper for dirty water and water up to moderate rough conditions. Sinking stick baits for rough stuff and clear shallows, floating sticks for calm, clear water to moderate rough water, pencils for distance casting over flats and parallel to reefs with slight chop.
Lure colours and flash are another essay altogether!
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: roderick walmsley on February 03, 2011, 06:21:47 PM
Aaron that was well put, the retrieve is just as important as the lure selection and the "wrong" lure can still catch fish with the right retrieve that suits the conditions. If you are fortunate to be fishing in an area where you are getting numerous bites then paying close attention to how the fish are hitting the lure can steer you towards wether or not you are doing the right thing with your lure and retrieve. On one charter out to Bugatti we had good numbers of fish coming up to the poppers but quite often pulling out of the bite at the last moment. Although it looked like they were simply missing the lures a change to stickbaits resulted in immediate hook ups. This situation turn around again later in the day when the fish switched back to preferring the "louder" poppers without any change in the oceans conditions. We simply put it down to a change in the fish's mood or target prey.
It is a lot easier to see this when you are guiding from a game boats tower as the fish is visible for a few more seconds before the angler sees the fish from the water level. Similarly speeding up the retrieve or throwing in a pause can also spur a fish to bite that is only chasing the lure. As has already been mentioned it is very much a case of horses for courses. If someone is throwing a popper a good idea is to have someone else throwing a stickbait and if they are being worked correctly then you will quickly find out what the fish are keying in on.

Cheers Roderick
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Karl Nelson on January 15, 2012, 10:15:04 PM
If someone is throwing a popper a good idea is to have someone else throwing a stickbait and if they are being worked correctly then you will quickly find out what the fish are keying in on.

Cheers Roderick

I reckon you should work as a team.
If one person is trying to swim a stickbait and someone else is banging away with a popper and the fish are shy, nobody will catch fish.
Concentrate on one or the other i say.
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Troy Marien on August 09, 2012, 05:15:43 PM
Definitely got some good info out if this. Will hopefully put me into in to contact with my first surface GT.
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Stuart Kelly on December 03, 2012, 07:42:35 PM
Great info guys!
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Wan Izhan on December 04, 2012, 02:04:42 PM
Any link to vimeo or youtube point to how to play stickbaits eg, Gamma, Siren Lure, Realbait, Penipen, Aswb...etc.....
Showing the correct techniques, equipments, and lure actions?
+ links to Carpenter Lure Video by Konishi-san ;D

Many thanks
Izhan
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Neville Haglund on December 30, 2012, 01:56:45 PM
My original Fiji pencil was the Yo-Zuri Surface Bull rigged with a single ST 66 on the tail.The reason for the one hook only was because the vast majority of fish caught resulted from a"chase" where by they always attacked from behind so hooked up on the rear hook.Also found it a lot safer when the fish was on board only having one hook to worry about.
The reason for using Surface Bulls was that there wasn't alot of others available at the time that could handle a decent GT.In saying that I have had the rear loop on one snap on me .These days with all the online tackle shops around the choice is endless so now when in Fiji regardless if I'm at the "sausage" the "supermarket"or the "big W" I use  Heru's ,Carpenters,HammerHeads, and yes I always have a Bull in the tackle box somewhere!!!
Title: Re: What's your favourite popping style for big GTs?
Post by: Chris Rowbottom on December 30, 2013, 11:02:20 AM
Any link to vimeo or youtube point to how to play stickbaits eg, Gamma, Siren Lure, Realbait, Penipen, Aswb...etc.....
Showing the correct techniques, equipments, and lure actions?
+ links to Carpenter Lure Video by Konishi-san ;D

Many thanks
Izhan

Great idea!
Does anyone know any instructional type videos on proper or common retrieves of sticks, poppers, etc?
Thank you!
C