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Topwater Caranx Ignobilis: Giant Trevally (GT) => Tackle & Techniques => Topic started by: Kevin Li on March 04, 2009, 02:01:56 AM
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Hi guys,
I've isolated 2 rods from the PD range and I need feedback in able to choose.
The black diamond 77 and the black mafia 76.
Fishing wise and for power, I'm looking for a rod similar in power and fishing capabilities of the Carpenter 78UHL.
For the casting bit, I don't have to worry as I'm used to casting very stiff rods to 14ft. ;)
I'll be fishing 130lb braid with big poppers of 180-200g and when required fish 170lb with 250g poppers.
The rating of the Black diamond 77 is rated to 15kg, can it fish beyond that when required?
Your feedback would be muchly appreciated.
Kev.
P.S is it right to say that the Black diamond 77 is more powerful than a tokara smith?
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Kevin,
In my opinion the Black Diamond sits between the Tokara and the 78UHL, (I have these three rods).
The UHL feels more powerful when loaded up to me. Having said that, the BD still hurts....
I have not handled the Black Mafia, but looking at the specs its a more powerful rod than the Black Diamond.
I think Aaron Concord at on this forum has both the Black Diamond and a UHL. He may be worth PMing about them as well.
Ken
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May also be worth sending a PM to Pat Victorino. He has used many PD rods.
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Nice choice!! ;)
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I've decided to go for a Black Mafia. Waiting for FH to give me a quote for the shipping.
Btw, what is the weight of the rod?
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Hi Kevin,
Rod weight of PD Black Mafia76 is 515Grams.
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Hi Pat ,
Would it be fair to say this PD rods are basically SevenSeas rods but with expanded models ?
Jon .
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Hi Jon,
We carry both the new Seven Seas and Patriot Designs rods. We have found them to be quite different in feel and design to each other. Both companies are making very high quality popping and jigging rods, but are heading down different tracks in terms of blank construction and asthetics.
Regards
Duncan
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Hi Kevin,
Rod weight of PD Black Mafia76 is 515Grams.
Hi Pat,
Thanks for the feedback. That is going to be a challenge to cast with for a few hours! Have you tried the black diamond? How does it compares in power in fighting and casting of heavy lures?
Kevin
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Hi Duncan ,
Thanks , just curious .
Jon .
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Hi Duncan ,
Thanks , just curious .
Jon .
Hi Jon,
Welcome back, I did a comparison on some of the 7 seas and PD rods recently, weight and spec issues on some models at least appear to be very similar. That was just a desktop study though.
Do you have good things to report to us temporarily desk-bound anglers?
Cheers
Andy
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Hi Andy ,
Check this : http://www.gtpopping.com/forum/index.php?topic=1147.30 (http://www.gtpopping.com/forum/index.php?topic=1147.30)
Jon .
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The best way I can surmise the PD Black Diamond against a SP78UHL is:
Same lifting capacity in the butt section: I scale tested both at 20kg.The PD felt like it had more to me in the butt.
The SP78UHL has less mid-flex than the Black Diamond and feels less comfy when locked up. It is a fast taper, high carbon stick.
The Black Diamond, with its Kevlar Shaft has more tip resistance though more mid flex when loaded up. Most people feel its lighter than the UHL until you read the scales when doing drag settings!
HOWEVER.....the Carpenter is a tendon snapping cast compared to the PD Black Diamond AND the Black Diamond has, even with the mid-flex, more tip resistance than the UHL, which means it not only slings/loads a popper when casting more easliy, it also works the big poppers easier than the UHL.
It ends up a Holden/Ford debate....2 heavy popping rods with different feels to get you to the same finish line....
As a big GT rod that I can fish more easliy, the PD wins....and I do love my UHL!!!
If you want even MORE grunt (and pain??) go the Mafia or Fire Vortex...
Most people I see going away on a trip longer than a day would find long spells with the Black Mafia or Fire Vortex too extreme.
Aaron.
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Nah, I think I was wrong.
I should have recommended that Mick and Kevin get the Fire Vortex! ;D
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Nah, I think I was wrong.
I should have recommended that Mick and Kevin get the Fire Vortex! ;D
Wait wait did some one said an UHL :-X ::) ;D ;D
fire vortex :o hmmmm ..... nah not for me.
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I was wrong Mick - you should have gotten one of these. After all, what is the worst thing that could have happened?
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The worst is he would have been thumped into a transom like a thumb tack on strike.......and then find to out that blue coloured UHL's were on sale while away on a trip.
Something like that Brandon. ;D
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I was wrong Mick - you should have gotten one of these. After all, what is the worst thing that could have happened?
yeah i got the Black diamond 77
which I and aaron had a good talk over it and the different from the uhl too .
but the uhl is a long way away waiting not know how long ???
now i am hoping to head out to budatti reef soon and bend my two new rod,s
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The worst is he would have been thumped into a transom like a thumb tack on strike.......and then find to out that blue coloured UHL's were on sale while away on a trip.
Something like that Brandon. ;D
WHAT ??? ??? did i miss out a blue colour UHL ???
i hope not ....
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The best way I can surmise the PD Black Diamond against a SP78UHL is:
Same lifting capacity in the butt section: I scale tested both at 20kg.The PD felt like it had more to me in the butt.
The SP78UHL has less mid-flex than the Black Diamond and feels less comfy when locked up. It is a fast taper, high carbon stick.
The Black Diamond, with its Kevlar Shaft has more tip resistance though more mid flex when loaded up. Most people feel its lighter than the UHL until you read the scales when doing drag settings!
HOWEVER.....the Carpenter is a tendon snapping cast compared to the PD Black Diamond AND the Black Diamond has, even with the mid-flex, more tip resistance than the UHL, which means it not only slings/loads a popper when casting more easliy, it also works the big poppers easier than the UHL.
It ends up a Holden/Ford debate....2 heavy popping rods with different feels to get you to the same finish line....
As a big GT rod that I can fish more easliy, the PD wins....and I do love my UHL!!!
If you want even MORE grunt (and pain??) go the Mafia or Fire Vortex...
Most people I see going away on a trip longer than a day would find long spells with the Black Mafia or Fire Vortex too extreme.
Aaron.
Hi,
Was that 20kg pull straight from the reel and then the rod loaded? With 20kg linear drag added with ring friction and rod bent this is a lot of power!
How much realistic linear drag can the black diamond fish? On the specs it says 15kg!
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Hi Kevin,
Aaron summed up the PD rods pretty accurately.
The Black Diamond77 has a softer tip than both the UHL & Black Mafia.
Ideal lure weight for BD would be around the 170g where as the BF76 will comfortably throw 200g chuggers.Power wise the Black Mafia is strongest-then UHL-and last of the trio of course you now know the answer in my opinion.
Pat
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Aaron - Very detailed sum up on the PD popping rods. I am very happy with my Diamond 77 and Platinum 84. Hopefully do not need to add another into my family of 4 PDs. ;D
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Kevin,
That was bent at around 25 degrees from the horizon, which, at 20Kgs is about as high off the water you will hold one of these rods with line wailing from the spool!
For drag rating purposes, the biggest thing is keeping the rod low and slightly curved to keep the hooks in when things are at max drag.
How many people do you know who could run 20+kg of drag through a 45 degree bent rod?? Most will have it flatlined to save their backs and make the fish work against the reel.....the rod at this ridiculous end of casting gear is a delivery tool of the largest poppers. They are NEVER comfy to bend up!
The 15kg of drag that PD rates the rod at is, like all rods, not rated when the rod tip is speared to the sky. It is usually at 30-45 degrees and at 45, this is a very real 15kg rod.....there are not many around that can lay that claim, nor, that you can hold onto in a vertical, circling challenge with a big GT for long anyway.
It is a heavy popping rod, that funnily enough, is actually obtainable at fairly short notice (usually 1 1/2 to 2 months from order date), which anyone who chases GT gear can attest is NOT easy to find stuff at times, let alone have the time to dawdle before ordering. This stuff goes quickly!
Kenny,
Thank you.
I try as much as I can to bend up/cast/fish with as many different rods that I can get my mitts on to help with discussions like this.
The ammount of gear that I now have at my finger tips is terrific when doing comparisons......far better than in 1995 when I started chasing these animals!!!!!
Aaron.
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Aaron it is also good to have people around with the wealth of information that you have, & that are willing to use it to help others around you
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Brock,
Cheers mate....thanks for the praise.
Aaron.
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Thanks for all the feedback. I'm going for a black mafia, if wanted a rod to throw 150-190, I would have chosen a lighter in weight rod less than 470g in another trademark.
I'm going to chuck the 200g+ lures with it, I might as well go for a strong/powerful rod with that sort of weight ratio i.e the 500g+.
Once again thanks you all for your advice and feedback. I'm going to try it in Mauritius from the shore and see how much distance I can get out of the rod. Then I'm going to use it in Rodrigues.
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Kevin,
Best cast so far with PE 10 and a 200gm EbiPop is 93m......
The Black Diamond will punch (and work) a 200gram lure.
It easliy slings it 70-75m which is a looooooong way.
If you feel the Black Mafia is for you, go for it!!!!!
It certainly has plenty of power.....too much for me :'(
Aaron.