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Topwater Caranx Ignobilis: Giant Trevally (GT) => Reports & Expeditions => Topic started by: Andy Rowe on October 14, 2009, 01:20:51 AM
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWNJETVfilg#noexternalembed (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWNJETVfilg#noexternalembed)
At last after nearly a year we have the footage of the 'Kaibatsu Surface monster' braking on a very strong GT. This was from our first to Alor trip on a very unsuitable craft, note Brads 'fighting hole' position. Brad was getting line on the fish but it looks like it was spooked by the boat and made sudden surge for freedom which resulted in the rod failure.
Enjoy ;D
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Dear Andy,
haha.. that was quite entertaining!
I do think was a slight element of high sticking in there.
Although the rod was held almost horizontally, but if the GT was dash across from under the boat, the acute angle between rod and line would still constitute the same effect as high sticking.
I guess the 'firing hole' just added more to the whole failure.
Can't see the angle of the line so I'm really not sure, just my opinion.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWNJETVfilg#noexternalembed (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWNJETVfilg#noexternalembed)
At last after nearly a year we have the footage of the 'Kaibatsu Surface monster' braking on a very strong GT. This was from our first to Alor trip on a very unsuitable craft, note Brads 'fighting hole' position. Brad was getting line on the fish but it looks like it was spooked by the boat and made sudden surge for freedom which resulted in the rod failure.
Enjoy ;D
How much drag?? ;D
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Hi Ah Gun / Adrian,
Brad was certainly in a difficult position to handle the fight.
I won't comment about the rod and I'm not sure I agree with 'high sticking', at the time of rod failure the fish was fairly vertical. I'm just posting the link btw.
Other factors which contributed to the situation included; the shallow bottom and hence the high drag setting (PE8 VarivasGT Max braid), the fish being hooked close to the boat and with plenty of fight left in it; the inability of the boat to maneuver and the inability of the angler to maneuver from his anchor hole.
I'm sure you are familiar with the spot Ah Gu where deep water hits a 200m long line of bombies. The area had big fish all over it with strong currents pushing the bait into the trap. If we'd have had your Kaisar boat we would have landed more than we did. In fact second trip back with kaisar we landed a 45kg fish on a Kaibatsu at the same spot.
Cheers
Andy
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Hi Ah Gun / Adrian,
Brad was certainly in a difficult position to handle the fight.
I won't comment about the rod and I'm not sure I agree with 'high sticking', at the time of rod failure the fish was fairly vertical. I'm just posting the link btw.
Other factors which contributed to the situation included; the shallow bottom and hence the high drag setting (PE8 VarivasGT Max braid), the fish being hooked close to the boat and with plenty of fight left in it; the inability of the boat to maneuver and the inability of the angler to maneuver from his anchor hole.
I'm sure you are familiar with the spot Ah Gu where deep water hits a 200m long line of bombies. The area had big fish all over it with strong currents pushing the bait into the trap. If we'd have had your Kaisar boat we would have landed more than we did. In fact second trip back with kaisar we landed a 45kg fish on a Kaibatsu at the same spot.
Cheers
Andy
No worries about the technicalities... dont want to be mean but the entertainment value of the video is undeniable. kekeke....
Alor definitly packs excitement and opportunities.
I'll have to wait till early next year before I have the chance to head up there again... *itch itch
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Hi AhGu ,
Here is another one from European forum , the rod broke at the same approximate area ;
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3010286783348626990&q=source%3A004334480836485322641&hl=it#docid=-8258680250922300222 (http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-3010286783348626990&q=source%3A004334480836485322641&hl=it#docid=-8258680250922300222)
Jon .
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Guys, I did think seriously about deleting this thread but have decided to let it remain. I want to make the comment that as a forum, we're usually very cautious with what we permit to be posted in terms of broken equipment.
The reason for this is that we don't think that it is fair for discussions that may lead to products being denigrated (often and usually without the appropriate context) are not in the interests of the members at large as it can lead to people being misinformed.
There have been a very small number of rods over the years which have developed a reputation for breaking inexplicably but in the very large majority of cases, these have resulted from abuse, rods being bumped causing some fracturing of the graphite and creating a weak point or angler error such as high sticking.
Few anglers are willing to admit error on their part.
I would also like to make the comment that there is nothing out there that suggest there is any manufacturing fault in the case of the Kaibatsus.
I have seen breakages in nearly every brand of rod out there at some point and many have been inexplicable. That said, I suspect these rods may have copped a bad bump at some time in the recent past prior to breaking. Most examples of breakages I have seen have been caused by angler error or abuse.
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wich rod are they?
where the 2 rods brock, i dont think they had damage caused by shock or injury
I've never heard of broken GT special, it looks to be a stong rod
but if kaybastu is not a strong one, why not tell users what it is?
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Laurent, any GT rod will break if it is abused or if the angler makes a mistake - this goes for a GT Special or anything else out there. I find it unfortunate that there already seems to be an impression that the Kaibatsu has a problem. I just don't think a couple of examples of breakages means there is a problem with the rod.
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on the video of jon li, the rod is not on a bad situation , not on a rush, not a bad angle and it breacks
just want to know wich rod it is
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Got 2 Kaibutsus, A Deep Monster and a Long Cast. Found them to be bullet proof and I pop every single weekend so I do not think there are durability issues at hand. Also Shimano have probably sold a lot more Kaibutsus than GT Specials so just one or 2 breakages probably do not signal design faults. Broke my Hots Tide Lez 77XXXH on a 10kg fish but seen a 40kg fish pulled up on one so like I say just one of those things.
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After many discussions on the breaking of rods and testing done while visiting Japan each year and though difficult from video footage.
I would put first video down to too much drag for this model nothing wrong with rod and second video is certainly in a very high position so to much drag as well hence rod breaking in same position. This area is also where SMITH, CARPENTER and the like will also break if to much drag is applied.
Remember that drag amount decrease the higher you lever rod.
I have attached a rod angle diagram from SMITH.
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Oh well. Kaibutsu DM broke today on a GT estimated at over 50kg. My mate mmanaged to land the fish and take a pic so the fish must have given up the same time as the rod.
Now here is the strange part. It broke in the lower section just above the reel seat so the top section is intact. Will send back to seller to see if Shimano can id a fault or else try to get a butt section off them. It was my old rod on which I landed my PB GT of 40kg in under 4 minutes so I do not know how much drag the SW18K was putting out when this happened. Have had the rod for a couple of years at least and caught dozens of good GT and YFT on it. Will let you guys know. ???
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Brads rod broke immediately above the reel seat also. It was the surface monster by the way.
The fore grip is very long, I wonder if under heavy load it puts too much stress on that point in the handle ??? ???
Love to see a photo of the 50 kegger
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Look like the same place as where my mate broke his. He will be back in town on tomorrow so I will have a look.
You expect the top section to go and I have loaded up a DM so wickedly in the past and it has held.
GT fishing I guess.
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Look like the same place as where my mate broke his. He will be back in town on tomorrow so I will have a look.
You expect the top section to go and I have loaded up a DM so wickedly in the past and it has held.
GT fishing I guess.
Aiii ;)
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there is no rod in the market that doesn't break,
rods has a life time just like any other things that we buy,
from what i saw i don't believe that the problem is from the rod or high sticking,
i am a big fan of Daiwa but from my experience i believe that at the time that the fish decided to take off the drag didn't give,
the dogfight tend to be a bit sticky on the drag side, if you change to carbonex you will feel a bit safer,
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Look like the same place as where my mate broke his. He will be back in town on tomorrow so I will have a look.
You expect the top section to go and I have loaded up a DM so wickedly in the past and it has held.
GT fishing I guess.
Aiii ;)
Hi Andrew ,
The three rods in this thread broke at around about the same area , in my opinion the blanks from which the handles are made isn't up to the task and it's the weakest point of those rods , hence the breakage .
Jon .
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Hi Jon / Sami,
It looks like there is a week point there, though to be fair the WV80XH appears to have an issue with the top part of the handle splitting, a different stress point though???
That Dogfight certainly had c-tex drag washers installed. I know the drag was locked down pretty good and I think Sami's analysis is fairly spot on. I think a big head turn and and the drag sticking did it.
I've used both rods, just my 2 cent but i think in extreme situations where drags are near locked the kaibatsu has too much handle for the rod and the WV too much rod for the handle. Though under normal conditions both rods are great.
GT fishing certainly finds the week points in all equipment eventually.
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I think you summed it up well Andy and Sami.
Most certainly a butt join design issue in both the Shimano & Carpenter. Understandably, two pieces exherting pressure on the other - the weakness is found with high drag pressure.
Collateral damage in the quest for GT. Such experiences keep us searching for GT - we wouldn't have the respect we do if this mighty fish couldn't break an anglers will or push gear to the point of failure.
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Hi Jon / Sami,
It looks like there is a week point there, though to be fair the WV80XH appears to have an issue with the top part of the handle splitting, a different stress point though???
Top part of the handle splitting is mostly caused by the rod being loosely inserted into the handle when the strike occurs , this loosening can be attributed by continuous casting where the big knot between the PE line n the heavy leader , nowaday I prefer to use lighter leader + heavy bite leader because of this .
The splitting of the handle has been known to happen on other models in Carpenter line so it is not inherent to WV alone , the repair is quite easy though , just wrap the split blank with thread used for wrapping guides and then put a new EVA grip over it , the handle can be used again without any problem .
Jon .
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I think you summed it up well Andy and Sami.
Collateral damage in the quest for GT. Such experiences keep us searching for GT - we wouldn't have the respect we do if this mighty fish couldn't break an anglers will or push gear to the point of failure.
well said Luke,
that is what keep us coming back,respect and challenge :)
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Seemed to have some drag bounce as well on the footage which may have had something to do with it but like Luke says ultimately something will give. I have used the Surface Monster and it is a very unforgiving rod. Used my Long Cast Kaibutsu today and got an estimated 25kg model. Very good under load for fish that size. Just hope it does not break any time soon.
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All good points mentioned guys. The size of the fish on that particular reef are enormous, we never bagged one there that trip. After losing a fair amount of poppers, the drag was tensioned higher with every popper lost. If we had a better boat it may have been a different story.
Full credit to Shimano for replacing the butt, something had to give. The rod was 5 days old. I feel the butts on the SM are 2 or 3 inches too long and it is hard to get a good grip further up the rod especially on the bigger fish. Awkward to lever them.
The next trip we pulled in some monsters on a similar Kaibatsu.
Brad
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All good points mentioned guys. The size of the fish on that particular reef are enormous, we never bagged one there that trip. After losing a fair amount of poppers, the drag was tensioned higher with every popper lost. If we had a better boat it may have been a different story.
Full credit to Shimano for replacing the butt, something had to give. The rod was 5 days old. I feel the butts on the SM are 2 or 3 inches too long and it is hard to get a good grip further up the rod especially on the bigger fish. Awkward to lever them.
The next trip we pulled in some monsters on a similar Kaibatsu.
Brad
Welcome to the forum Big Unit...caught any 25 kg red bass lately :o ;)