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Topwater Caranx Ignobilis: Giant Trevally (GT) => Tackle & Techniques => Topic started by: Mike_Tan on February 12, 2011, 01:08:09 PM
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Hello people, I experienced fitting issues with some popping rods over the years. These rods fit perfectly when I first purchase them but after a while all of them developed fitting issues. Some were so bad that only 1/3 of the ferrule could fit into the butt section. I was told that this is due to uneven expansion of the top and bottom section of the rods as they are using different types of carbon. Honestly I'd rather live with a rod that's stuck and carry it around at full length than to sand down the ferrule. Do you think its a good idea to leave the rods assembled during storage to prevent/hinder the uneven rate of expansion from taking place? Would this cause a ferrule failure?
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I dont leave any of my rods assembled when in storage....I had one so stuck it wasnt funny.
I understand your idea about deliberately letting it get stuck for a while but it could be risky..?...It aint to crash hot if your rod is stuck and you need to travel. ???
Pete
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Over the years, I have sanded the male joint of two Tokaras and then two Komodo Dragons on at least three occasions each. I've also done it to Carpenters and a couple of Fisherman. I've done it as a matter of necessity because if a rod doesn't fit, I got to make it fit. To date, I've never had a failure from sanding. I'm certainly not recommending you all rush out and do it but I'd suggest that the blanks are not as sensitive to sanding as we are led to believe.
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Peter/Brandon- Noted with thanks! Guess I should keep some really fine hobby craft sandpaper at home.
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I agree on sanding with very fine paper, also having had some ridiculous non-fit issues.
A gentle reminder that it takes very little sanding to get the desired fit again so don't over do it.
I know some rod builders would cringe at the thought, but surely such fine reduction of the blank would not cause too much an issue. Perhaps someone could forward a sound technical reason against such methods.
Andy
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Hi Guys
the only advice I can offer is to ensure that the sanding is even, not just around the blank but also for the whole length of the male section. The risk is that if the sanding is not even front to back you create a point load and a fulcrum on the edge of the handle, under load this then becomes a significant weak point. I would suggest buying a set of calipers or dividers that you can run over the blank to ensure there are no high points causing the ill fit, you may find that all you need is to knock off a couple of high points instead of sanding the whole ferrule. you can then use the same calipers to check as you sand.
Cheers
Bob
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Andy/Bob- excellent points! Thanks for responding.
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Agree with sanding.
Do not use the rod unless just about all (say only 5 or 6 mm may not be in properly).
The rod will break if 1/3 or 1/2 is out.
Have a broken Komodo Dragon to prove this.
Light precise sanding and some Smith ferrule wax should do the trick.
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I have heard this problem occurring especially with Smith rods. Any thoughts on that and why?
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I have heard this problem occurring especially with Smith rods. Any thoughts on that and why?
Was told Smith uses different grade of carbon for their top and butt sections. These different materials have different rate of expansion which results in the fitting issues.
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The ferrule joints are ground by the manufactures to fit. If they dont fit, thouroughly clean out the female section of the ferule with alcohol and a twisted cloth-re try the fit. If the fit is too tight still, it will not do any harm if you carefully sand the male ferrule using 1000 or better 1200grit wet and dry caborundum paper-sand it wet and wash out the paper often in a bowl of water with just a drop of washing up liquid to help disperse the fine dust when washing out. Its best done using a hard flat block with the wet n dry paper wraped once round the block. Turn the rod on some sort of lathe set up as you sand it using light pressure, keeping the block flat on the male ferrule. Wash and dry the ferule regularly for trial fits until you get a firm fit. If tere's any slop you have gone too far. Then apply candle wax and polish off on the lathe. I too have had this issue on many rods.
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The ferrule joints are ground by the manufactures to fit. If they dont fit, thouroughly clean out the female section of the ferule with alcohol and a twisted cloth-re try the fit. If the fit is too tight still, it will not do any harm if you carefully sand the male ferrule using 1000 or better 1200grit wet and dry caborundum paper-sand it wet and wash out the paper often in a bowl of water with just a drop of washing up liquid to help disperse the fine dust when washing out. Its best done using a hard flat block with the wet n dry paper wraped once round the block. Turn the rod on some sort of lathe set up as you sand it using light pressure, keeping the block flat on the male ferrule. Wash and dry the ferule regularly for trial fits until you get a firm fit. If tere's any slop you have gone too far. Then apply candle wax and polish off on the lathe. I too have had this issue on many rods.
Earl. you've got to show me how its done when we meet up in May!
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I'll look forward to it Mike !
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Had the same with my OR Widowmaker (made by Smith??) - the two sections were stuck fast on a trip and the only way to release them was ice bag round the butt section to free them up - the lower grade carbon doesn't shrink as much as the blank and hey presto came unstuck for the rod tube home :D (thanks to Dave Foyle)
Dave reckoned the majority of manufacturers build the butt from lower grade carbon and I believe that he is right - the main rod is produced on a top spec mandrel with the required tapers ... why would you do the same for an arm's length of beefy parallel tube??
Anyway food for thought - Dave's tip and knowledge saved me leaving a popping rod on the boat as a present for the crew!!!
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I have actually just discovered this problem myself.
Have just received a Ripple Fisher Inifinity 80. Of the 10.5cm ferrule, there is around 1.5cm that does not want to fit into the female section.
Does anyone think this will cause issues? I dont want to sand it if I dont need to, but similarly I dont want to snap the rod!
Dan
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1.5 cm is quite normal with a new rod.
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Thanks Mark
Do you think it is worth getting some of the ferrule wax mentioned earlier in this thread and trying to force it all the way in?
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I have actually just discovered this problem myself.
Have just received a Ripple Fisher Inifinity 80. Of the 10.5cm ferrule, there is around 1.5cm that does not want to fit into the female section.
Does anyone think this will cause issues? I dont want to sand it if I dont need to, but similarly I dont want to snap the rod!
Dan
Dan there's nothing wrong with your rod so just keep the ferrule clean and do not try to force it all the way into your handle section. Doing so would probably kill your rod instantly :o The problem I highlighted is for rods that fit nicely when you first purchase it but later becomes impossible to aseemble due to the uneven expansion of both sections. Wax and other similar products are meant to fix loose fitting ferrules and does not help tight ferrules fit better. By adding wax to your ferrule now will probably make 2.5cm of your ferrule stick out from your handle section :)