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Brandon Khoo

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Re: Twisted Leaders: Instructions + Diagrams
April 30, 2007, 08:35:07 PM
If the sharks win, it will be a bloody accident. I've given up after thirty years   :-[
If it swims; I want to catch it!

Laurie Banks

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Has anyone seen " LEGENDS 5 "  ?
Unfortunately  I dont speek japanese, but there is a demonstration for tying
a heavy leader that even my old mind was able to understand after repeating it
a couple of times.

Brandon Khoo

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no, the only one I've got is Legend - I assume it is the first one
If it swims; I want to catch it!

Laurie Banks

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I must have found it early.
It has some awsome captures on BIG GT's
The leader is very simple to make , but I dont know if I could explain it.
If someone else has the dvd  and can explain it ..
go for it, otherwise I am willing to try.

Brandon Khoo

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Laurie - explain it to us!! I think we're all curious enough to see what this is.
I have some idea on how Okubo rigs based on discussions with people who have fished with him but interested to see what the latest is.
If it swims; I want to catch it!

Laurie Banks

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OK here goes.
He uses 170lb and 300 lb trace,
The materials that you use will determine what size figure 8 crimps you use.
You will need.
- 90cm 300lb trace (this will convert to about 60cm of leader)
-enough 170lb trace to make your desired leader length.
-4 "figure 8" crimps.
-tool to crimp.
The 170lb is doubled through one hole of a crimp and the 300lb is put in the other.
Crimp them together.
Slide the other 3 crimps on to the 300lb.
push the top 2 up to the join and forget about them.
put the 300lb through the tow point of your lure, and through the bottom crimp
crimp this off leaving a30cm tag.
twist the 300lb around itself , now slide the two crimps that you forgot about
down and use both to crimp off the end of the tag.

The size of crimp will be determined by your trace selection.
Make sure that the lighter one DOUBLED  and the heavier one suit the crimp.
The number of twists will be determined by the thickness and stifness of the trace.
 Hopefully you can understand this.
Let  me know if you cant.

Brandon Khoo

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so Laurie - I'm pretty sure I understand what he is doing with the 300lb as that is what I understood he does but not so clear on the 170. The 170 is doubled - ok. How then does he attach his PE to the 170?


OK here goes.
He uses 170lb and 300 lb trace,
The materials that you use will determine what size figure 8 crimps you use.
You will need.
- 90cm 300lb trace (this will convert to about 60cm of leader)
-enough 170lb trace to make your desired leader length.
-4 "figure 8" crimps.
-tool to crimp.
The 170lb is doubled through one hole of a crimp and the 300lb is put in the other.
Crimp them together.
Slide the other 3 crimps on to the 300lb.
push the top 2 up to the join and forget about them.
put the 300lb through the tow point of your lure, and through the bottom crimp
crimp this off leaving a30cm tag.
twist the 300lb around itself , now slide the two crimps that you forgot about
down and use both to crimp off the end of the tag.

The size of crimp will be determined by your trace selection.
Make sure that the lighter one DOUBLED  and the heavier one suit the crimp.
The number of twists will be determined by the thickness and stifness of the trace.
 Hopefully you can understand this.
Let  me know if you cant.

If it swims; I want to catch it!

Laurie Banks

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I cant work that one out.
I spoke to stephen polzin today and he tried to explain it to me,.
He may be a better one to try.(some instructions are easier to speak than to write)

Greg Burt

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 A Question on strength and abrasion. :-\
 Does a completed twisted leader change its rating to double, or stay the same as your Bimini is looped to two legs of one strand ?.
 The pic shows Jigging 86lb braid looped once over left leg, then right leg, then through the middle. The leader is 60lb 2.5m long mono crimped to 700mm long 150lb FC.
 Does the leader become 120lb in strength and does it have the same abrasion resistance as 120lb single strand or something in between ? ???.[go Neil]

PS: I've got a 2004 article by Damon where he was using twisted leaders fully to the jig.
 
Greg 'FFF' Burt

Neil Griffiths

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I think it's fair to say that 2 strands of 60 do not have the abrasion resistance as one of 120. The reason twisties are popular is because they simplify and slim down rigs for casting. Okubo in Legends Five is tying his bimini to 170lb braid with a simple system. It is the start of a Fisherman knot in the leader and finished with a uni knot in the braid instead of the jam used in the traditional fisherman. Obviously if you watch Okubo this method works fine!!
All the japanese anglers that I have talked to basically use whatever Konishi, Okubo or Suzuki use, ergo not a twisty.

I like Okubo's shock leader system it's so simple, who could be bothered tying something like 200 to 400lb leader together when a crimp will do such a good quick and easy job. Start off with a twisty and crimp the appropriate shock leader on the end, it works a treat.

As far as Okubo's twisting and doubling back the leader and crimping on the popper goes you would need to not be a constant lure changer or have a quiver of rods to use this system. If you watch all the legends they don't use swivels and split rings much at all and the only reason we can come up with to explain this is that a ring and swivel in front of the popper will break the water before the popper bloops therefore reducing the intensity of sound generated. Me, well I do like the option of quick changes so for the time being i'll stick to split rings and swivels or solid rings.

Greg Burt

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I'm using two fig8 crimps a couple of mm apart to join the twisty to the FC at the end [2 mono on one side and FC on the other]. I then cover with a small piece of plastic tube, this is protection for the top runner as we know sometimes the jig leader comes in fast through a short jigging rod. Is shrink tubing a better option and how is the best way to protect the leader when heating [I use a heat gun].
Greg 'FFF' Burt

Che Carson

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Hi Greg,

I use heat shrink on my leaders with no problems to date. I use a heat gun and hold it at least 20cm from the leader. I use a minimum of 100lb leader so using lighter leader you may have to use a bit more care.

Cheers,
Che

Jay Burgess

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Where can I find info on tying the nail knot? Also, how do you thread the leader back through the twists (for the bight leader)..??

Neil Griffiths

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The knot you use to tie to heavy lines together is best done by using a tube. Tie a basic snell with one line on the tube, slip the other line through the tube and slide knot off tube onto the leader, partially tighten and repeat process with non knotted section. Then tighten and close both knots together gradually. This can be done with twistys and very heavy leader if required.

It takes a bit of practise, as always.

Neil

David Sharples

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Re: Twisted Leaders: Instructions + Diagrams
August 18, 2007, 08:02:47 PM
Does anyone have any thoughts on forming end loops in braid using dacron like in this link? It looks good and saves on tying the 80 turn bimini?

http://www.fishingkites.co.nz/fishingknots/spectra_fishing_line.html

I use something similar with braided mono on finer braid but wonder how it would stand up with 80-100lb ?