Frictions knots for connecting your mainline to your leader

[Al Morrison]

Mark,

I solved the melting issue by buying a small battery powered soldering iron, its a little bigger than a lighter, heats up quickly and offers a perfect melt with no chance of catching your main line. I heat up the end, then press it to make a little ball in the knot. I'm not sure of the brand but when home can post it. I bought it in a hardware shop.

[Hayden Coleman]

Hi Guys, Im new to the forum. I super keen on popping and have fished Solomon Islands and Fiji. Caught only small GT's so far but im headding to New Cal early next year to chase the larger ones. Was wondering what sort of leader you guys use when useing single strand leader with the FG twist ? Also do you guys use a bite leader?
So far i have been using 150 lb Penn 10x with a FG knot to 100 lb Braid. Any advise on this would be very much appreciated.

[Warwick Joyce]

Hayden, I use the same knot. You will need to up the lb a lot for new cal 200+ for leader and maybe even 130lb mainline. I do not use a bite leader (but have no need to) you may want it around new cal? I use Gallis shock leader, there are heaps of good brands but I steer away from hard flurocarbon as its harder to get the FG to bite into.

[Brandon Khoo]

My only reservation of your rig is that Penn 10X is a very, very hard leader and is not ideal for friction knots in my view. The idea behind a friction knot is for it to bite into the leader. I don't know how well it bites into the 10X.

I do know guys who use friction knots on fluorocarbon and who obviously continue to do so because they haven't had any problems. I personally wouldn't do that but each to their own. With ultra hard material like fluoro, once a friction knots starts slipping, it won't stop.

I use 170lb exclusively in New Caledonia, same as I use for most other places. You can use a bite leader if you like. I use this occasionally if targeting bigger fish.

[Mark Harris]

As Warwick says Hayden, you might have to up your poundage for New Cal.

My usual GT set ups are PE8 (or sometimes PE10) with an FG Knot to either single strand 170 lb or 200lb shock leader. There are lots of good brands of shock around but my favourites are Varivas, YGK Galis and Jinkai, and Sunline for lighter weights.

For bite leaders, I rarely use them but you will find a lot of information if you do a forum search.

[Mark Harris]

My only reservation of your rig is that Penn 10X is a very, very hard leader and is not ideal for friction knots in my view. The idea behind a friction knot is for it to bite into the leader. I don't know how well it bites into the 10X.

I do know guys who use friction knots on fluorocarbon and who obviously continue to do so because they haven't had any problems. I personally wouldn't do that but each to their own. With ultra hard material like fluoro, once a friction knots starts slipping, it won't stop.

I have been thinking a fair bit about the fluorocarbon issue in recent weeks and was actually going to post it as a new subject.

Like you Brandon, I have always deemed fluoro to be unsuitable for friction knots as it is so hard.  The whole logic of a friction knot seems to fail if you apply it to a very hard substance like fluoro.

On the other hand, I have never heard first hand of an instance of a friction knot slipping on it.  Can anyone here own up to having that happen or witnessing it happen?

The other issue with fluoro is its lack of elasticity which makes it a far from ideal shock absorber.  But given its greatly improved abrasion resistance when compared to the soft supple mono most of us use, I reckon I could live with that.

The issue for me is whether a friction knot does actually fail when applied to the shiny hard surface of fluoro.

Anyone?

[Warwick Joyce]

Mark, I do tie the FG on my barra gear which is 30lb Accubraid to Sunline FC Rock 50lb which is fluro and have had no issues at all. I did find that if you do too many wraps to start with they wont all tighten and if left that way the knot will come loose. I limit the wraps to 7-10.

I also tie the FG to multi-strand wire when jigging if the razors are giving me the s#!ts, I use mono coated wire though so I can get a good bite and I also haven't had an issue with that.

Having said all that, there shouldn't be any reason why we can't use FC and just adjust the knot to suit.
Anyone who ties the FG knows as soon as it is tightened you know if it will hold or not.

My preference will stay with shock leader for the "shock" value

[Graham Scott]

I use 2 set ups generally PE8 to 200lb mono leader for most situations, but my second rig is PE8 to 130lb flouro. My theory is I give this lighter leader a go if I think the GT's are being cagey. The lighter leader is also better for working smaller lures or stickbaits. I haven't had any trouble with FG knots on fluoro. The only issue I have had is a couple of times is the FG totally letting go in the middle of a cast, very little load. Even after the same knot has landed a couple of fish. I put it down to bad finishing with half hitches which have worked loose, this was on the mono leader.

Now I guess I will have to worry every time I hook a fish on the flouro....thanks for ruining my confidence.

[Stu Hardy]

I have used flurocarbon extensively with a PR knot for Kingfish jigging here in NZ with 80lb braid and never had one fail, even on a 100+ kg bronze whaler.

[Gavin Chau]

in 4 years I've had one FG fail - tested to over 10kgs but (similar to graham) failed on a cast?

I've also tied a lot of them a lot using fluorocarbon without issues - they seem to grip better if there is a big difference in the diameter of the leader compared to the diameter of the braid

[Mark Harris]

Anyone who ties the FG knows as soon as it is tightened you know if it will hold or not.

Thanks for the comprehensive reply Warwick.

Just on the one point I have snipped above... the main way I know if an FG is formed properly is seeing it dig into and grip the leader after the the big tighten. That does not happen with Fluoro.

Graham, never lose confidence!

Stu, thank you and that is a strong testament.

[Mark Harris]

On the casting failures mentioned, are you sure it is the actual knot failing and knot the braid itself exploding under load stress near the knot?

[Gavin Chau]

in my case the braid was intact - the whole FG knot was still in place including the half hitches up the line?

it was a very hard leader though and light for the braid used - 60lb ande and 80lb braid - I'm relatively confident that had the leader been thicker (or the braid thinner it would have been ok)

[Graham Scott]

Yes me too, I got the full FG knot back...minus the leader, but it looked like some of the half hitches were missing.
My theory is as you cast, if the hitches are not really tight they slowed get dragged further up the braid by the friction in the runners, then one by they drop off.  Its like you are slowly picking your knot loose. Once you get close to no hitches the FG totally drops off as nothing holding it in place....longest cast I ever made.

[Mark Harris]

Yep I am sure that can happen. The half hitches should not slip though if you burn a little ball in the tag end of the leader.