Line and leader break offs when using high drag setting

[Nathan Tsao]

Is the problem that the OP described a common thing for many people? I have just never seen this before myself or amongst the guys over here.

[Jussi Saarinen]

Brandon, the line was not stuck in the underlying line following the breaks.

I think that is because the underlying line (first ~200 mtrs) was manually spooled under high (+6 kg) pressure (with belt, gloves and many pauses ) and you only cast and rewind the outer/last 80 mtrs or so. There simply were not enough "loose" line to make it get stuck.

However, there were enough loose line to cause enough extra friction/tension when the fish was taking line against the heavy drag so that the relatively more loosely spooled line was pushed to the top/bottom of the spool to cause a temporary stop. The closer to the boat the strike occur, the more loose line you have on the spool.

We saw this happening when dragging out some 80-100 mtrs of line on land, against the same drag we were fishing with. When we stopped and turned the rotor, we could continue to pull out line and there was no clear "evidence" that the line had dug into the underlying line upon occular inspection.

Since this happened on three different spools, all with new line (JB130lb, TT130lb and TT100lb), I do not believe that a bad batch is the culprit.

Again, I am surprised that not more people have experienced similar problems.

I will shift to solid line on my next trip and also use SOM spools rather than JM spools and see what happens.

[Brandon Khoo]

Jussi, I have never experienced what you did in nearly 15 years of GT fishing. For the line to be so loose on the spool that you can noticeably pull line out without the spool moving ...... well, that is a real worry! Using hollow braid would not result in that.

[Jussi Saarinen]

And this when using mostly poppers, which keeps more pressure on the line than stickbaits...

[Barry Kurten]

Hi Jussi,

As I mentioned in my earlier post about proper spooling preparation. Have you not considered that you could be suffering from "braid slip" ??
The braid has nothing to bite into to (backing), so it actually just slides around on the drum of the spool ??

That would be about the only thing that could make sense to be the cause ? But with braid slip you would notice the line digging into the under laying line most of the time.

Like Brandon, I have never noticed this issue and I can not see how this problem could be caused from fishing with stickbaits and casting all day, everyone would be suffering from this problem if that were the case.

[Mark Harris]

I don't think I understand the problem any more 

I thought from our discussion that the line had impacted and jammed?  But from your description above, that did not seem to happen.

I am lost on this one.  Barry's idea is interesting but like him I am pretty sure that if the braid was slipping en-masse the line will have dug in.

The only time I had impacted line which resulted in a bust off left the braid MASSIVELY dug in... took serious effort to get it out again.  This was not due to loose spooling but to the line finding a tiny channel between the main body of braid and the spool lip.

I am beginning to think that your drag settings were maybe just too high for the line you used. You mentioned fully tightened drag and then half a turn back. That is truly massive (on a Stella 18000  I am guessing) and not an initial drag setting I would even ever think about using.

[Jussi Saarinen]

Barry, all spools where manually spooled, using Frank Fernkorn's Bee's Knees Reel Spooler (http://www.jdmtackle.com/product_view.php?product_id=2113) using some +6 kg pressure. I put TESA tape on all spools before spooling the line so there is no way that the line was slipping.

Mark, the line did dig into the more loosely spooled line (the last ~80 mtrs that had been out of the spool when casting), but not to the degree that it got "stuck". That happened once to me in Panama when I was stupid enough to let someone else spool on line on my reels. Then I had to dig out the line from the spool just as you described.

As I said, the thing happened to the third spool on land, but then I could ask my friend to stop pulling out the line, readjust the rotor arm and then continue. Obviously this is not possible with a +30 kg GT in the other end of the line. We never broke the line on this spool when fishing and I am currently trying to determine which line (JB or TT) I had spooled onto the two spools (one 130lb and one 100lb) that experienced all the break offs.

If it was the same brand on both these spools, that may be the answer why the lines broke. However, had we not stopped pulling out line on the third spool then something would have broken on this set up as well. The phenomenon was the same on all three spools/reels, all JM Monster Spools (two 25k and one 16k) with two different brands of Hollow Core - 130lb (two spools) and 100lb (one spool).

Will report back when I have been able to sort out the lines.

[Brandon Khoo]

Jussi, I am in a very similar boat to Mark. The only way the line would snap if it was stuck inside the spool would be if there was no give at all in it. That way, the fish either turns around or the line snaps.

It might be worth testing the line for shock loading. you don't need to get too scientific. Just tie a leader on secure the braid to something and see how much pressure it takes with a shock load to snap the line. 130lb should take a very sharp and hard load to snap it.

[Peter Olesen]

I think the JM spool provides more drag than the stock spools. When the bail arm hits the spool, it is a self-reinforcing process (creating more drag). I found at home that there is physical contact between bail arm and spool when the drag is pulled at 14 kg and up (JM16000). Jussi, did you try to measure the drag when you came home?

[Jussi Saarinen]

I haven't tested the drag yet, but I just realized, upon inspection, that the five GTs I landed on my 2008 Stella 18000 have ruined the reel. The whole part where the rotor arm is attached is bent! (Will try to resize the pictures and post them.)

Mark, the drag was set at max and then turned back 3/4 of one turn.

[Brandon Khoo]

That is not very well designed!! Any system is only as strong as its weakest point.
It could be that when the bail arm hits the spool, it's causing enough of a jerk to snap the line.

Jussi, warped rotors are a pretty common occurrence in GT fishing. Depending on how bad it is, the reel may still work fine.

[Chris Tan]

Could it be possible that the ceramic on your roller arm is nicked causing the braid to break?

I had that happen to 2 of my reels during the same trip as the washers were already worn and lost alot of fish.

Last year I was using a JM 25000 spool and had line dig in as well when a dogtooth came up very near the boat to take my lure. The line dug into the spool and the 130lb braid broke. I had assumed it was due to my poor initial line packing

[Brandon Khoo]

Chris, I was leaving it for you to raise the point on the bail roller! 
It's very interesting that you've experienced the same with a JM spool

[Mark Harris]

Just on JM Monster Spools.... I bought one and I immediately noticed that is was grazing the rotor on a 18000. Under load that would get very serious. It is a piece of kit to be avoided IMO and I gave mine to a local friend who uses it on a 20000 for jigging, so far without trouble.

For GT fishing there are no circumstances I can think of where a 25000 size spool is necessary?  Possibly has applications for big Tuna?  But I still would not put one an an 18000 having witnessed that it is in fact too big for the rotor.

[Sean Costello]

On the monster spools its worth noting that they have a more conventional designed drag than the original stella spools and have an increased start up inertia as well as a higher maximum drag. Id say as mentioned previously, the line simply couldn't cope with the shock load when fishing that high a drag along with the starting inertia and a bit of loose line.

Personally I don't see the need for aftermarket spools when fishing anything over the 10000 size as the original stella spools provide the best drag system particularly in terms of smoothness. if line capacity was an issue id go the 20000 max spool over the others.

Sean